Introduction

[MikeN-OR-508]

Hello Todd,

Well I'm a young 40 Year old, and flying has been a childhood dream, and constant fascination. As a young Iowa Farm Kid, I used to build card-board airplanes and fashioned flight controls out of anything available, and let the imagination run wild. After High School I joined the Military, and dreamed to be a fighter Jock. Well That dream was crushed when I found out I had partial red/green color deficiency. I went on to serve , and instead of flying them, I was jumping out of them!! After the Military service, I returned to the states and worked for AS/QX airlines; ground, freight, tkt agent, ops controller, and finally a GEG/PDX Station trainer for all positions, while attending college, and working in construction as well. I had started flying in the Military aero-clubs whenever possible, flew from GEG, and TTD as well, but life stepped in again, and I stopped short of my PPL. I now have been in engineering for some-time, and my daughter is off to college next year. I'm starting to plan my DREAM JOB NOW!! My wonderful wife is currently a SkyWest F.A. and based in SLC., and commuting. We met working for AS/QX, and the airlines is where WE are most happy.

I'm very much looking forward to asking all questions from your experiences. I flew again last week, on an intro, and just like riding a bike,,minus forgetting the tail #,,LOL...Not to drag on.....

Thank-you all in advance for your time, and knowledge!!


Mike

[SkyWest Todd]

Hey Mike,
I can relate all too well in what you are going through. I grew up on a farm in Idaho, when I was a kid, I would chase the crop dusters on my bike. I also have the red/green color deficiency. It's not a problem, I have some info on that if you need.
I finished my ppl then went to ATP for the career pilot program in PHX. It was the fastest and most economical way for me to switch careers. I did plenty of research and would recomend that you do the same, don't just take my word for it.
If there is anything specific I can help you with, or questions about the industry, please let me know.
Todd

[MikeN-OR-508]

I assume ATP does not offer any discount programs, ect?? What is the best way to finance the training?? suggestions?? I will go with my PVT and a min of 85 hrs TTL, 25 Xcountry PIC...Any-thing you would do different on this subject?? I just learned recently ATP closed their school here in Oregon, Major Bummer!! (MAR). And for now did you instruct at ATP, before getting hired or go straight to Skywest?? By the way do you know Wes Mattews??

I know your busy, respond as time allows....


thanks, Mike

[SkyWest Todd]

Hey Mike,

Keep the questions coming, that's why this forum exists. I wish I would have had a pilot coach when I was trying to make some decisions. I'm glad to help.

Will you need to finance all or part of the training? I cashed in a portion of my retirement and used Sallie Mae for a portion of my training. They may allow you to defer your payments for 18 months, by then you will have a flying job.

When my payments came due, I paid it off with a home equity line of credit for the tax break. If you do use retirement money, consult an accountant and see if there is any way you can use the cost of training to offset the tax penalty associated with withdrawing the retirement money. Some banks offer some loans that may be used for education etc. I didn't research the banks much, Sallie Mae was quick and easy and I knew I would be converting it when the payments were due.

If you were to get your PVT at home, you may be able to spend a little more time with the family prior to going to ATP. You will be able to get your PVT and 85 hrs in ATP's program in 2 months. It also gives you a great understanding and experience of the IFR environment. You will probably get your PVT in 40-60 hours. Then you will go on x-country IFR flights with a flight instructor to get your hour up to 85 prior to the Career Pilot Program. That IFR experience is really good for the students.

If you choose to do it at home, it would allow a little more time with the family but I would suggest you meet and fly with your instructor at least 3-4 times per week. 3-4 times per week becomes cheaper for you because you won't have to re-learn things. It's much more efficient than once per week. Then you have to weigh out the cost and effect of working, training 3-4 times per week and finding time to spend with the family. It will run your time pretty thin. Getting your PVT at home or at ATP is yet another one of those hard decisions. It will be faster and more efficient at ATP simply because that is all you will be doing, 7 days per week and sometimes flying twice per day.

I did instruct at ATP. I already had my PVT when I started thinking about making the career change. I did the Career Pilot Program in PHX in 92 days, not a penney over budget. I took about a month off and was hired as an instructor for ATP and did that for 6 months. I was then hired by an airline where I worked for 6 months prior to getting hired on by Sky West. I wouldn't trade my CFI time for anything. That was a great experience! I'll always keep my CFI ratings current.

I don't know Wes Mattews but the name sounds familiar.

I know this is getting a little long but some of these decisions are a little different for guys like you and me, as compared to someone fresh out of college etc.

I don't know of any current discount programs at ATP but you may want to call 1800 ALL-ATPS and speak to one of the financial advisors. Have you talked to any of them yet?

Keep the dream alive. These decisions don't always come fast but they become solid as time goes on.

Todd

[MikeN-OR-508]

Hey Todd,

Long or not it is great info...Wes was the SIM check-airman for upgrades I think; his official title I'm not sure of, any-how he left for the right seat on WN. Well I have been cruching the numbers, and I will be contacting ATP, about specialized programs...I'm assuming that the cost/ and time is adjusted for already having some ratings?? Unfortunately my retirement plan will severely penalize me for an early with-draw. So I'm left with Home-equity or selling the house, and property.

Did you and the family all move to PHX?? I read in other forums sections that Texas is definately a no-go. I'm all about the professionalism, so I would expect nothing short of this for pilot training. I take this seriously, so I don't need young pilots goofing off , if you know what I mean..

On another note I have found a great dedicated CFI here locally, and cheap!! He is a Retired Fire Capt. He is a stickler, Love that, always throwing a new twist on an old task. I will be flying at least 4 times per week, I set my own work schedule. Any more suggestions, such as type ratings before arriving at school. I do plan to knock out the PPL, SEI, if at all possible before scheduling something in the fall, besides I would rather be in PHX in November than SLE...LOL....Enough for now...

By the way What is the hiring status at SKW??


Mike

[SkyWest Todd]

Hey Mike,
The main program for ATP is the Career Pilot Program where it will take you from a PVT to a CFI, MEI, CFII. As you know, the prerequisite for that program is to have your PVT, 85 hours and I think it's 25 hrs X-country.
I wouldn't waste the time or money getting your Single Engine Instrument rating. You'll want to call the 800 number but I'm pretty sure there won't be any reduced costs for already having your instrument rating in a single engine. All of the ratings and flights are orchestrated so that you will have the minimum requirements for the next rating.... ie. The hours you gain in your multi instrument rating will count toward your total multi time to obtain your multi commercial rating.
My family didn't move to PHX. Your housing will be included in the cost of the training. The apartments are typically two bedroom and two to a room. You typically won't all be there at the same time.
I wouldn't believe everthing you read in the forums about any specific training location. I'm not sure what you heard but you can find good and bad anywhere you look, especially if you're looking for it, if you know what I mean.?.
If you go into the program with an open mind and good learning attitude, it will all come together. It's a lot of information in a short amount of time but it works.
It sounds like you found a good PVT instructor. He sounds like one of those instructors that will work you hard and you'll learn a lot. I would get your PVT and take your written test for your Instrument rating. Either get your 85 hours locally or you can purchase a time building package at ATP to get you up to 85 hours prior to begining your Career Pilot Training. Those time building packages will be a great intro to instrument flight. You will go on cross countries on an IFR flight plan.
I'm not sure what the hiring status is at SKW, I know they have been hiring into the Bro and have heard they are going to begin again for the jet but haven't heard anything official.
When will you begin your training for your PVT?
Talk to you later, Todd

[MikeN-OR-508]

I'm starting local training as soon as the OR weather cooperates alot more..I have been to the local field 3 times this week, and vis, and wind have really been terrible for June in OR, feels more like November. DLC flys here locally to SLE, and besides the wife having a local to commute from, I have the advantage of re-familiarizing myself with the radio communications with my scanner, listening to your fellow crew members. I have decided to get my PPL here, build time up and figure out my finances. As a VET, Oregon VA has a nice little spot of $$ they will give me, and I'm awaiting a response form ATP on forms ect. My wife (Really Supportive) and I have been re-searching any available $$, besides loans for the training.

I'm wondering if you could give examples for pay based on the following:

Assuming SKYW:

1. Training PAy??

2. 1ST Year FO CRJ, and so on..based with guaranteed mins..

3. Expectations to make lets say 50K +.

This would calm my Nagging LIL "WHat- IF's".

I guess lastly any rumors on hiring freeze, aquisitions, airport closures, ect. I see they tried to get Express Jet, with a tender offer.

Well Sir, I hope flying is treating you well, and your getting some family time, Your experiences and information are invaluable to me and many others,,FLy Well talk to ya soon...Since I'm rambling on and on...Been a long week at the day job!!

Mike

[SkyWest Todd]

Hey Mike,

It sounds like you are closing in on a great plan of action and getting ready to put it into motion. That's great!

If you were to plan on pay etc. based on Sky West... You can plan on $22 per hour while in training. I think they still pay 60 hours per month maximum while you are in training. Your training will last roughly 8 weeks. After the training, your guarantee goes up to 75 hours block or credit. If you're not familiar with block / credit time, your wife can explain it from her experience as a flight attendant.

Per Diem - For your time away from base on your flights, you will also get $1.60/hour 24 hours per day while you are away from your home base.

The reality is, you won't make much money the first year as an FO. I went into it with very low expectations of a great schedule or money in the first year.

Your second year, it wouldn't be too hard to make 50K per year. You will have a better schedule (worth more money) based on your seniority and your pay goes from $22/hour to $35/hour. There is also a little bonus pay for flying the 700 or 900 vs the CRJ 200.

In a nutshell, I wouldn't expect much more than $1600/month the first year but 50K the second year wouldn't be too tough to do.

This is a very fluid industry which is obviously reacting to the price of fuel on a daily basis. It will move up, down, round and round but the reality is that people will still fly. They aren't going to go back to riding a train to get from LA to NYC. With that said, it is tough to predict where the airline industry will be in 1 or 2 years but people will still be flying.

Sky West is currently hiring. You can go to www.pilotjobs.com and see the latest from multiple airlines on that website.

Let me know when you take that first flight and get started with your training!

Did ATP get back with you yet?

Talk to you soon. Todd

[MikeN-OR-508]

Afternoon Todd,

So Far I have decided to start my PPL at a local FBO, with MR. (STickler!! )Love this guy,,,I have located the only log-book I have left and found that it has a cummulative total of 38.5 hours, 6 Cross-Country, PIC..I did a discovery flight and had the controls for the whole time, I'm suprised my memory of the checklists, procedures, went really well. Power-on stalls, Slow flight, ect...My instructor believes, after some short refreshment, he will let me solo again..Only after he/ and I are comfortable. Only down-side they have 2 150's, and a VFR 172 on the field. Af friend of mine gave me is current "Sporty's" complete ground school course, and I have been reading, and watching the DVD's closely. My CFI will begin spot testing my knoweldge base this week. I hope to test for the PPL, on or before 15 July. I have used the internet to find a lot of great resources for the testing, weather, Pilotage, introduction to IFR ect...

I have really tried to use all my resoucres to the full extent. A friend of mine works at the GARMIN center here in SLE, and has offered me free; yes FREE,
intro, and simulator for the Garmin 430 GPS system, and others for basic intro, when I'm ready.

No I have not heard back from ATP, yet it was late when I called them, So I'm sure they will get back to me on Monday.

The main issue I have right now is balancing the costs, and having no income for 3 months..if I were to attend the 90 day fast track, then having to stay there to build hours as a flight instructor. It will take some time to formulate a financial plan, and have the resources to survive while attending school. Of course my wife's income as a F.A. is not stellar as you well know, but she is very supportive.

So here are some more questions for now..

1. Did you get your choice of base, or was it based on SS # or something?

2. Did you get your choice of A/C??

3. I assume all you ground school was in SLC??

4. How long were you on Reserve, and what would some-one expect in this economy??

5. What were your TTL and ME time when you were hired?? What is the current mins??

6. Are you crashing in DEN as required and commuting??

7. And most imprtantly are You LOVING YOUR JOB??

8. Any of course if you ever find yourself flying into SLE, Eug, PDX, let me know in advance, and we can have cold 1 , if time allows..Bottle to Throttle you know....


Take care,

Mike

[SkyWest Todd]

Hey Mike,
Your story sounds all to familiar. It think i had 40 hours, in my logbook when I started flying again.
Ya, get that written test out of the way as soon as you can. Having it behind you will be a huge relief.
If you get the training on the Garmin 430, that will be handy. The Seminoles at ATP have dual Garmin 430's.
I don't have much time, so I'll just answer those questions.

- Your base is assigned using seniority. You chose from a list but it is decided on seniority.
- I have never had a choice of aircraft. It is based on your background and their needs at the time of the interview.
- All ground for the CRJ is in SLC. I think the bro drivers go to Fresno for the sim but I'm not sure.
- I'm still on reserve, BUT it's only because I transfered out of ORD. The guys I trained with have lines in ORD and MKE but DEN works better for me so I was on reserve a little longer. The base is a little more senior.
I should hold a line in July.
-When I first went into the airlines, (not Skywest) I had over 600 total time and 360 of that was multi engine time. I think the mins have changed a little bit in all the regionals. I'm not sure what Skywest requires now.
- I do have a crashpad in DEN. I spend about 5 nights per month there.

I'm lovin it! It's almost like having a real job

I jumpseat to Denver this afternoon and my trip takes me to Medford, OR tonight, Huntsville, AL tomorrow night and back to Denver on Friday. Then I'll jumpseat back to Idaho and be off for a while.

I gotta run. Talk to you later,

Todd