Ready to Fly!

[MichaelM-MO-509]

Good Morning Ken -
My name is Michael McQuillen. I am 47, in great health and shape and ready to start a new career in 18 months. I work for the Kansas City Police Department, am a major, and currently the CO of the Shoal Creek Patrol Division. I wanted to be a pilot long before wanting to be a police officer, but my wife and I got married right out of high school, a family was started, and we needed immediate pay and benefits. Fast forward 28 years, and all three of our kids are out of college and married and I am now eligible for retirement with a nice pension that will help with the "hungry" first years of aviation. My loving wife has approved of the career change and has green lighted me to be away for two years, while she continues to work here in Kansas City(Black&Veatch). I read in your bio that you attended Annapolis - very cool. One of the greatest places in the world I believe. My favorite two places were the Chapel and the memorial to those "Still on Patrol".

I read everything aviation I can get my hands on and have been up maybe 20times in small GA aircraft. I have a college degree in Criminal Justice, graduated from the School of Police Staff and Command and the FBI National Academy. Our goals have been to pay for schooling and weddings and remain debt free, so up to this point, money for my training just wasn't there. When I retire (fall of 2010), I will be in a position to not have to finance flight training.

Goals: I want to be a commercial pilot and fly the line. I was almost born on a 707 in 1961, and it must have been a sign as aviation has been a passion as long as I can remember. My police career was too stable to leave and it would have been crazy to leave prior to being eligible for retirement. I am looking at Flightsafety/Falcon/Delta Connection. I am flying to Miami at the end of June to tour various schools and would like to tour ATP in Ft. Lauderdale. I see that you are based in KC. Love to buy your lunch and pick your brain about the various options that are out there or you could come by the station. Thanks for your willingness to impart your wisdom!

Michael

[Republic Airlines Ken]

Michael,

First off, thanks for the informative intro. It sounds like you've made a lot of sound career decisions that have brought you to this point. You're defnintely in a position where you can realistically consider this with your retirement coming up, kids through college and a supportive spouse. I have flown with a number of people in similar situations (2nd career after military or other retirement) and there's certainly less pressure on them with regard to the early financially challenging years of the transition.

Since you're thinking about beginning this change in approx 18 months, you and I can both reasonably hope that by the time you're done with your training the economy is on a good upswing, and this industry and every other are moving along at a good pace. Most importantly you should be able to have a very good idea of the process you're getting into by then and you and your wife will be well prepared for the transition. It's good that you're looking at a number of flight academies. If you have the opportunity to stop by most or all of them to see what they're all about, you'll be a far more informed customer and pilot.

I just received my preliminary June schedule (I'll probably try to swap some trips around with other pilots to get more commutability) but I will have a few free afternoons in Kansas City between trips, so we can definitely try to coordinate something over lunch or at some time that's convenient for both of us.

In the mean time, hopefully you'll find this forum to be a useful place to ask questions and get some info on any aspects of the process, the training or the airlines that you've been wondering about.

Take care and I look forward to your questions!

[MichaelM-MO-509]

Ken -
Thanks so much for your kind response! I have a trip planned to Florida the week of June 28th to check out as many schools as I can. By the first of the year, I would like to have my search narrowed to one or two. I don't want to hit you with a firehose of questions, so I will just stick to the big ones pressing right now:

I have been considering the ATP/Gulfstream program, which gets you out the door with 250 hours of multi engine - turbine time. From some professional pilots and posts I have been made aware that the program is looked down upon as they are using students to staff what should normally be a full-time F/O position. I have also been told that some airlines may not even consider your resume if you came from Gulfstream. My question is: From a hiring standpoint, how important is the shcool or reputation of the school you came from? Or, is all that matters are your tickets and time?

Second question is the issue of instructing. I have heard the school of thought: the faster you get hired, the better off you will be (so skip instructing if you can) and then the flip side: Instructing helps you truly master and understand every aspect of the aircraft, FAR's and other issues(from a police standpoint I know this to be true). Have also heard that some hiring boards look down on someone who did not instruct (like they most likely did). Which is best?

Please drop me an email when you can at Michael.McQuillen@kcpd.org and I will give you my cell phone number and we can work on that lunch/dinner when you are at MCI.

Thanks for your time!
Michael

[Republic Airlines Ken]

Michael,

Two good questions. I'm a little tight on time tonight (need to squeeze in some sleep at the crash pad before an early show tomorrow!) so let me give you a non-rushed response by tomorrow afternoon/early evening.

Thanks,

-Ken

[Republic Airlines Ken]

Michael,

Thanks for your patience... With respect to Gulfstream, I'd have to say that every path to a career in aviation has its supporters and detractors. Gulfstream, amongst many other career options is but one way to skin the cat, and there's no question that you gain part 121 experience quickly there. What's most important is what you get out of the overall experience and how you present yourself in an future interview. That's probably paramount to everything else. I've flow with a number of former Gulfstream pilots here and they're not noticeably different from anyone else. Point being... I'm not aware of any hiring preferences based on Gulfstream, but, you gain good experience there, and you certainly also gain good experience training at the airline you go to following Gulfstream, which is pretty important too. I have seen a number of career changers from there though, and I think there's something to be said for a person who knows what their end-goal is and shoots for it.

As for flight instructing.... I'm a little biased when I say that I truly believe that it's a fantastic way to learn flying, crew coordination and being able to deal with adverse situations. Former instructors joke that in very few other lines of work do you face someone literally trying to kill you on a daily basis! Truly a joke (most of the time), but you really learn quite a lot teaching people how to be safe and proficient in an airplane...

But, realistically, I don't think there's one best way to gain experience prior to being at an airline. People from different flying backgrounds bring different experiences to the cockpit when at their first airline, but the backgrounds can be very varied. I've seen instructors, cargo pilots, jumper (parachute, or in pilot speak... meat bomb!) pilots, and many others in newhire classes at our airline, and that's no different than anywhere else.

So, these are not definitive answers, but there's no absolute answer to your questions as well. There are certainly lots of routes into commercial aviation.

[MichaelM-MO-509]

Thanks for the informative reply, Ken. I value your insight and information. Thanks again!

Michael

[MichaelM-MO-509]

Hi Ken -
At the end of June, I am flying to Florida to visit various Flight Schools. Could you give me some advice on what I should be looking for and what questions I should be asking?

Also, in trying to decipher various schools ciriculum, I have struggled to determine exactly how many flight hours you actually graduate with - and how many are actually in the air /vs/ a simulator. Should I be concerned with this? Are both types loggable hours?

Thanks for the information. You are a big help!

Michael

[Republic Airlines Ken]

Michael,

It's ideal to be in a position where you can actually stop by a number of flight schools you're considering. There's a lot to consider, and a lot of different ways flight schools get you to your end goal. Here are some of my thoughts on it...

Off the top of my head, my biggest concerns when looking at schools and the FBO route personally were:

- length of program
- cost
- reputation in the industry (quality instructors, program, etc)
- multi-engine time
- safe aircraft/ good maintenance program
- possible opportunities to instruct/ good connections to airlines or flying jobs

Some of the above are pretty self-explanitory...

One big and possibly vague consideration is the learning process. There are places that have classroom environments, and a very structured process. This can be good for some people. It can also be slow. Other methods can be more one on one with less structure/ more flexibility to move quickly through established knowledge areas and focus on any challenging points.

There are ways to "beat a dead horse" with respect to groundschool training - I once took a private pilot written test groundschool with about 25 other students, meeting several nights a week for several weeks. The process was slowed so much at points by teaching to the most "challenged" individual (there's only so many times you can describe cloud clearance limits for visual flight rules before your eyes glaze over!), and more or less reciting the book, that it actually turned people off to flying.

On the other hand, an immersion style learning process, i.e., spending the vast majority of your day, every day, learning and applying your knowledge can allow many people to absorb info and procedures, retain it effectively, and move quickly to bigger challenges. ATP is quite a bit like this, and it's a big reason why the training can be done at a fast pace. Mind you, this isn't for everyone and you have to come prepared and focused. Stay ahead of the game, keep your head in the books, ask lots of questions and this can be an excellent method.

One thing to avoid, in my opinion, is getting multi-engine instruction from a place that doesn't fly their twins often. Primarily from an instruction standpoint, I viewed the multi-engine instruction as pretty critical and wasn't as interested in a place where that was the exception to the rule.

The cost issue was pretty important to me. That is... overall stated cost of program, and likely additional costs from extra training, etc. For starters, flight training is no small chunk of change. Personally, I didn't go into the process feeling that I absolutely needed something like ATP's set price training - I didn't feel like I was the sort of person who would need a lot of extra training and thought I would be at the lower end of the cost estimates for some programs. That being said, I've known some extremely smart and competent pilots who have been through shady programs with useless cost estimates and rapidly escalating costs and training lengths. I'm glad it wasn't a worry for me, though I hadn't considered it much then. I would certainly ask questions along those lines - and look around for input from different sources to see general trends in that experience.

Honestly, your best bet when you're looking around these different flight schools, is to talk to the students there. Decide what your own priorities are with your training, and get a feel from a number of students and instructors at each place to see whether it's in line with your expectations or not. Whatever you do, look beyond anything that might only be flashy glossy reception area hype, and look into the meat and potatoes of the program.

As for flight hours, yes there are a number of different types. It's a good question to ask. Multi-engine flight time and multi PIC (pilot in command) is pretty key, when looking to eventual airline jobs. There are typically minimum multi hours required by many regional airlines... a common bare minimum number in a normal job market is 100, though depending on where the hiring cycle is, that can of course be higher or lower. Total flight time is of course important. Really, any program will get you headed in that direction, but it's typically the job you have afterwards flight instructing or doing some other type of commercial flying that builds your total flight time, and possibly multi-time.

Sim time... well, it's commonly called that, but it's officially FTD (flight training device... basically a non-motion sim). Up to 50 hours of it can be used towards time required for certain certificates - so that can help speed the training process while keeping costs down. Additionally, FTD training can be a really effective way to supplement instrument training. Being able to quickly repeat ILS approaches, pausing to point out problems, failing specific instruments and setting weather and other variables can help raise the challenges when you're ready or fix problems much quicker than in the real aircraft. FTD time is not considered flight time per se, but it definitely has its place when used properly.

So, that's a pretty broad stroke on what things might be worth your consideration with regard to flight school options. Let me know if I can clarify any of that or if you have any specific questions about flight school or training differences. Of course, I'll be most familiar with ATP's training, but I think that I can help you at least prioritize some of the pros and cons of different programs and methods.

[MichaelM-MO-509]

Hi Ken -

Great info as usual. I really appreciate your thoughtful and candid feedback. Please let me know when you are going to have some time in Kansas City this month. We have the best barbeque in the world! Thanks and looking forward to hearing from you!

Michael

[Republic Airlines Ken]

Will do! Let me get a look at my schedule and see what may work out well.

big fan of KC BBQ!